Toxic Mold with Bridgit Danner: Rational Wellness Podcast 267
Podcast: Play in new window | Download | Embed
Subscribe: RSS
Bridgit Danner discusses Toxic Mold Illness with Dr. Ben Weitz.
[If you enjoy this podcast, please give us a rating and review on Apple Podcasts, so more people will find The Rational Wellness Podcast. Also check out the video version on my WeitzChiro YouTube page.]
Podcast Highlights
1:22 Bridgit moved into a new house in Portland, Oregon and she was having a lot of recurring symptoms of poor health, so she worked on her gut and did some IV therapy and saw some naturopaths. She wasn’t getting much better and someone asked if there might be mold in her home, since her symptoms got much worse when she moved into the new house. There was no visible mold in her house but Portland has a very moist environment and they had a musty basement and there had been a little water intrusion. They turned out to have a mold problem land besides remediating the mold by removing walls, etc. you have to get rid of most of your belongings, since mold can penetrate anything that’s porous and even nonporous things like refrigerators and computers. Bridgit and her family lost pretty much everything and she only has one Tupperware bin left of important documents.
6:41 The most common symptoms of mold illness include fatigue, brain fog, digestive issues, chronic pain, headaches, weight gain, hormone problems, mood issues, and immune issues.
11:30 The best first step if you suspect mold illness is to do a visual inspection of your home and look under your sinks and around your bathtub and in your basement and in your crawl spaces.
12:13 Mold inspector. A good mold inspector should be taking multiple sample types and not just one air sample. They should be swabbing and they should use a moisture meter to check the walls. They need to look at gutters and how well water is draining away from your house.
14:41 Once mold is found, there is no other good solution but to cut out all the affected materials–wood, carpet, flooring, etc. Afterwards you need to clean your air ducts and surfaces using a soapy or essential oil-based cleaner. Some surfaces, like wood beams will need to be sanded and then cleaned. Your furniture and your clothes and books should really be removed. If you can’t part with all of them, you can put them in storage and then revisit them in a few months.
20:49 Mold can be an underlying causative factor in chronic digestive issues, in Lyme disease, Hashimoto’s thyroid problems, and in various hormone imbalances, such as low libido, weepiness, gaining weight, and irregular periods.
26:24 Mold detoxification. First get out of the moldy home. Then make sure you are eating a whole food diet and Bridgit recommends a MATH diet, which is microbiome-friendly, anti-inflammatory, time-restricted, and hydrating. Also make sure that you are doing some exercise and getting sunlight and make sure you are sleeping and pooping daily. She loves for clients to use sauna and coffee enemas and dry brushing. Bridgit also likes castor oil packs and Epsom salt baths and she will often combine these with essential oils.
27:58 Essential Supplementation. Before going into the specific mold protocols, Bridgit likes her clients to be getting some essential nutrients for the liver and brain to work, including B vitamins, magnesium, and fish oil.
28:50 Specific Detoxification Protocols to get rid of Mycotoxins. Bridgit’s top favorite supplements include binders, CoQ10, Broccoli seed and sprouts, and Glutathione. CoQ10 helps support the mitochondria, which are really affected by the toxicity. CoQ10 is also an antioxidant, and antioxidants are also very important. And so are electrolytes. Glutathione is the most prevalent antioxidant in the body, so it gets depleted with chronic mold exposure. Broccoli seed extract supports the glucuronidation pathway where some mycotoxins are broken down. Some of Bridgit’s favorite binders include charcoal, zeolite, pectin, and humic acid.
Bridgit Danner is a licensed acupuncturist and a certified Functional Diagnostic practitioner. Her interest in natural health grew from an interest in protecting the environment. Bridgit now educates about toxins and detox through her online community and coaches women on how to detoxify through a Functional Medicine approach. Bridgit has published a book on this topic, The Ultimate Toxic Mold Recovery Guide: Take Back Your Home, Health, and Life. Her website is BridgitDanner.com.
Dr. Ben Weitz is available for Functional Nutrition consultations specializing in Functional Gastrointestinal Disorders like IBS/SIBO and Reflux and also specializing in Cardiometabolic Risk Factors like elevated lipids, high blood sugar, and high blood pressure and also weight loss and also athletic performance, as well as sports chiropractic work by calling his Santa Monica office 310-395-3111. Dr. Weitz is also available for video or phone consultations.
Podcast Transcript
Dr. Weitz: Hey, this is Dr. Ben Weitz, host of the Rational Wellness Podcast. I talk to the leading health and nutrition experts and researchers in the field to bring you the latest in cutting-edge health information. Subscribe to the Rational Wellness Podcast for weekly updates. And to learn more, check out my website, dr.weitz.com. Thanks for joining me. And let’s jump into the podcast. Hello, Rational Wellness podcasters.
Our topic for today is toxic mold and mycotoxins, and how this can make us sick, and what to do about it with Bridgit Danner. Bridgit Danner has been a licensed acupuncturist since 2004 and a certified Functional Diagnostic practitioner since 2015. Her interest in natural health grew from an interest in protecting the environment. Bridgit now educates about toxins and detox through our online community and coaches women on how to detox through a functional medicine approach. Bridgit has also published a book on this topic, The Ultimate Toxic Mold Recovery Guide. Bridgit, thank you so much for joining us.
Bridgit: Thanks for having me. I love talking about mold.
Dr. Weitz: So, please tell us about your personal journey with your health and your experience with mold illness.
Bridgit: Yeah, so I moved to Portland, Oregon to start my practice and didn’t really know anything about mold or anything like that. It’s a wet climate. I think a lot of the homes there have mold actually. So, second or third home I lived in, yeah, I was having increasing symptoms like working on my health a lot. It would get better and then worse again. It was hard to pin down because there’s so many different symptoms and mostly, people would just tell me, “Oh, it’s stress.” I started studying functional medicine. I worked on my gut.
Bridgit: I had a really clean diet, but then I just tanked again and started getting some IV therapy and seeing some naturopaths and it just wasn’t getting better. That was the first time someone finally mentioned to me, “What about your home? Is anything changed in your environment?” And that’s the first time mold came up as a question, which I think many of us who have these mold stories have one of those moments where you’re like, “Oh, could it be mold?”
Dr. Weitz: That’s always a tricky question too when you’re talking to clients, because a lot of times, they’re not aware that there’s any mold.
Bridgit: No. I made a lot of mold inspector friends now. Most mold isn’t visible. It’s in the walls. For us in our home, yeah, we had very, very little visible mold, but I did know that we had a musty basement and a basement that it had a little water intrusion that I did know. And then, we got an inspector. And then, our house, like many homes had more than one place where water had intruded and mold had grown. So, that can be part of the problem is if you have a whole big home, it’s often not just one area. There’s been something in the attic and the crawl space and the basement and the windows. And so, that was the case for us and the start of a big journey of cleaning up the house and working on our health and all that.
Dr. Weitz: And not an easy thing to get rid of mold, huh?
Bridgit: No. If you have a widespread problem and your health has really been affected, it’s worst case scenario for your finances because you can’t really keep much. And I hate to tell people that. If you have generally a good home and maybe you just had a brand new incident in the bathroom that you take care of right away, you’re not going to lose all your belongings or anything. But if you’ve been living for a long time in mold, it’s affected all your belongings, it affects all those porous areas or even like little nooks and crannies and nonporous things like refrigerators and computers. So, it becomes very hard to clean those things. So, we really lost everything. I have two Tupperware bins. Maybe I only have one Tupperware bin left now of important documents. That’s all I have from that whole time in my life. So, a lot of grief. There’s a lot of shocks that you’re dealing with the same time that your health isn’t good.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. What about the fact that some people are just not sensitive to mold? Do you think… because a lot of times, you might have four people in a family and one is really sick and maybe one or two, they haven’t noticed anything? Do you think that they’re actually affected and just don’t know it or their bodies able to get rid of it and it just doesn’t affect them?
Bridgit: Yeah. I think both things are true. So, some people do just detox better genetically or they’re younger or just whatever’s happened so far in their life positions them better to identify and clear toxins. Like my son, for example, was basically born in that home. He had a huge mold colony under his floor. And he did, to your point, when we finally much later tested his urine, he did have mycotoxins but he never really presented. So, I think sometimes, we do have them but we’re living with them fairly successfully. I think it can catch up with you though too. Like some people are just very hardy and they don’t really notice things going on with their body. Even things like-
Dr. Weitz: Maybe some people just make friends with the mold.
Bridgit: Kind of, but then you can also be ending up with cancer out of the blue, right?
Dr. Weitz: Right. There you go. Right. They didn’t know about that stuff, right?
Bridgit: You’ve been in a moldy house for 20 years. Yeah. So, it is connected with some long-term diseases too.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. Autoimmune diseases, hormonal problems, thyroid.
Bridgit: Alzheimer’s is a big connection I know about now too, which is something we’re all afraid of really.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. Dr. Bredesen talks about mycotoxins.
Bridgit: Yeah.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. Can you talk about what are some of the most common symptoms related to mycotoxins?
Bridgit: So, I think the two biggest ones are fatigue and brain fog. Those are pretty common and you pretty much hear those reported the most. It’s from the mitochondria and the brain being affected. And then, from there, it could be so many different things. Digestive issues probably right up there, lots of food sensitivities, chronic pain and headaches, weight gain, hormone problems, mood issues, because it’s a toxin that can affect and travel in so many places in the body and affects the immune system. That’s why there’re going to be just so many different types of symptoms. So, it sounds a little ridiculous how could it be causing all these things, but it really can.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. It’s just similar to a virus. If it hits your GI tract, you’re going to have GI symptoms. If it hits your brain, you’re going to have more brain symptoms.
Bridgit: Yeah. I don’t work with a lot of long-haul COVID but when I hear about it and read about, it’s pretty similar in some of its effects. It’s this chronic inflammation. So, that’s what mold creates too.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. And mold seems to also adversely affect immune system in a similar way that viruses do also.
Bridgit: Yeah. For sure. Creates a lot of confusion and like you said, it can lead to autoimmunity.
Dr. Weitz: So, when you suspect one of your patients may have been exposed to… they’re showing symptoms that might be related to mold illness, to mycotoxins. How do you recommend they go about testing your home and or office?
Bridgit: Yeah. So, this is tricky one because it depends if you rent or you own and your budget. Let’s just say hypothetically-
Dr. Weitz: Let’s say you own your home.
Bridgit: Yeah. Let’s say you’re a homeowner. In the end, you’re going to need a mold inspector to see what the source is and a good one.
Dr. Weitz: Right, but do you recommend maybe starting with something less expensive? Because what I have found is sometimes when you first start talking to a patient about this, if they’re not aware of there being any mold, they’re going to be a little apprehensive about spending thousands of dollars until they really know that there’s something there.
Bridgit: You can. I don’t think it’s foolproof to do some DIY testing when you’ve never done it before, but there’s a company called ImmunoLytics that you can buy these plates and swabs and they’ll tell you how to position them around the house. It’s very affordable. They’ll do a consultation with you. So, that’s a decent option.
Dr. Weitz: Have you seen ERMI testing?
Bridgit: Yeah. Personally, I don’t think the ERMI results on their own give you much insight. But there’s a friend of mine who has something called the ERMI Code where you can take your ERMI results. And it’s pretty affordable. They’ll put them into their supercomputer because they’ve analyzed so many homes. So, with that information, you can say this is a high-risk home or that thing. But because the ERMI wasn’t designed for a residential homeowner situation, the test is very difficult to read for the average person.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. So, for those who are listening who aren’t aware, ERMI is a way to test the dust in the house to see if there’s evidence of mycotoxins, right?
Bridgit: Yes. But it was designed for some governmental use first before the public caught on to it, so that’s why the results are pretty [inaudible 00:10:43].
Dr. Weitz: Is there another way that you can test the dust in your house?
Bridgit: There’s one other test called the EMMA that tests for specifically mycotoxins. So, I like that in terms of being a health practitioner, like the ERMI is just telling you overall mold load, not all the strains are toxic, blah, blah, blah. The EMMA, at least telling you about toxicity. I wouldn’t say their report or their consultation is very interesting. Like it’s very basic. It’s just yes or no. So, yeah, it’s tough because there’s a lot of questions in this space about what’s best and there isn’t an easy answer.
Dr. Weitz: Right. But maybe it’s a good first step.
Bridgit: Yeah, yeah, yeah. The cheapest first step. Well, even before your plate tests, just walk around your home. I have that in my book is like you can say, “Oh, there’s no water in my home.” Well, think about it, look around, look under your sink. Most people probably never been in their crawl space. And I had someone on my mold summit. He said 100% of crawl spaces are moldy, 100%.
Dr. Weitz: Wow.
Bridgit: He’s never seen one not. So, there’s just areas of our home we don’t check, signs of like a brown line or a white crusty line, mold around your bathtub. So, that’s a first thing you can do, that’s totally free, is start looking around.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. And then, when you get an inspector, how do you know you’re getting the right inspector and what should the inspector be doing?
Bridgit: Yeah. I think you can read reviews, you can ask questions. So, they should be taking multiple sample types, not just one air sample. So, they should be swabbing. They can do a moisture meter of the wall, which you can also buy yourself. They’re going to look for like how things are draining, how your gutters are draining if there’s any water around your foundation. So, basically, you want somebody who’s really thorough and investigating in many ways. I’ve definitely heard these stories where somebody just walks in and they’re like, “Looks good to me,” and then leaves. And that’s like I don’t know what that’s about.
Dr. Weitz: That’s probably the inspector sent by the apartment manager.
Bridgit: Yeah. Yeah. And I think in this space, it will happen slowly. Like some of my friends in this space are starting to offer some training programs and stuff so that people in those situations can be more informed about how to properly inspect.
Dr. Weitz: I’ve really been enjoying this discussion, but I’d like to take a minute to tell you about a new product that I’m very excited about. I’d like to tell you about a new wearable called the Apollo. This is a device that can be worn on the wrist or the ankle, and it uses vibrations to stimulate your parasympathetic nervous system. This device has amazing benefits in terms of getting you out of that stressed out sympathetic nervous system and stimulating the parasympathetic nervous system. It has a number of different functions, especially helping you to relax, to focus, to concentrate, get into a deeper meditative state, even to help you sleep, and there’s even a mode to help you wake up. This all occurs through the scientific use of subtle vibrations.
For those of you who might be interested in getting the Apollo for yourself to help you reset your nervous system, go to apolloneuro.com and use the affiliate code, Weitz10. That’s my last name, WEITZ10. Now, back to the discussion.
Dr. Weitz: And then, once they do find mold, what are some of the hints for what needs to be done for proper remediation?
Bridgit: So, there really much isn’t a way to avoid like actually cutting it out and removing. I think that we tend to want to save money by, “Oh, can we put bleach on it or paint over it?” That’s not how it works. So, if there’s materials like drywall, carpet that have been affected, they need to be just completely removed and then re-drywalled and the area cleaned and different steps. So, I would say just don’t think you can skip the step of just old fashioned like it’s a construction project.
Dr. Weitz: Right. And then, you’ve got to make sure they get all of it out, right
Bridgit: Yeah. And then, afterwards, be cleaning your air ducts and surfaces. You can use a soapy or essential oil-based cleaner. Some surfaces need to be sanded before they’re cleaned. Like if there’s been wood beams, you can’t really just wipe those with soap. You have to actually sand them a bit and then clean them. And then, like we mentioned earlier, depending on the extent of it and the extent of your ill health, you have to think about, “Is my couch that’s been sitting in this room for 10 years harboring mold and mycotoxins?” So, you can potentially put a plate on that and test it is one option. Or another thing you can do for instance, like with your clothes or books, you can put them in storage and then revisit them in a few months. That’s what we did when we moved. We put some things in storage that we still hoped we could keep. As soon as we opened that storage unit, I was instantly sick. So, I knew, “Okay, I can’t keep these things.” But sometimes, you’re not ready to just give stuff up. Right?
Dr. Weitz: Right. But generally, things that are porous like furniture and carpets are going to be… and mattresses are very likely going to have mycotoxins, correct?
Bridgit: Yeah.
Dr. Weitz: So, you’re pretty much going to need to get rid of them, unfortunately. Right?
Bridgit: Yeah. Unless, like I said, if this is just some new incident that you catch right away, that’s a different story. This is more like a chronic thing. Yeah.
Dr. Weitz: Right. And then, what about clothing? What’s the best way to wash and de-mold your clothing?
Bridgit: Well, you can potentially use borax in your laundry or there’s a few other products out there. I think one’s called EC3 or something like that. Honestly, I couldn’t really save any of my clothes. I think I’ve saved five items because I would wash them and do these things. And then, I’d put my face up to them and they’d give me a headache. And then, you’re affecting your washing machine. So, I feel like you can spend a lot of time spinning your wheels, trying to clean things, and then realize it didn’t work, but it could work. So, something-
Dr. Weitz: And do you recommend that people move out or do you think as long as they put up plastic sheets and stuff, it’s okay to live in the house while it’s being remediated?
Bridgit: I think while it’s being remediated, you should definitely not be there. And that’s a big mistake that I made that made me a lot sicker. And now, to be honest, my remediator could have been more conscientious of protocols, but they just aren’t all. And some of us don’t really know what we’re getting into.
Dr. Weitz: And if you decide to move out, wherever you’re going, whether you’re going to stay in someone else’s home or apartment or a hotel room, how do you know that place is going to be mold-free?
Bridgit: Yeah. You don’t know for sure but you can do that visual inspection again or your five senses inspection. Don’t move into a basement apartment. There’s some simple things to chat. You can ask questions if you’re… Generally, it’s not recommended to try to go buy immediately because it is pretty common that there’s mold. And at this moment in time, you’re very sensitive. So, committing to a purchase right away is a bit risky. So, it is better to live with family, live in your RV, whatever. But yeah, definitely re-exposures are pretty common, but they’re not guaranteed. Right? So, it really frankly took us moving out of state to be in environment we felt was safer. But I’ve lived in two homes in Arizona now. I haven’t had any problems. So, I think it can feel like it’s following you and it’s everywhere. But there will be a point where you get in a better home, but you have to maintain that home. Right? You don’t change your washer hose, which many of us don’t even think about. Eventually, it’s going to crack and fail. So, a lot of this is just learning about home maintenance and, yeah. Because as long as we live in homes, there’s always a chance of floods, plumbing errors, that thing.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. One of the things I notice in California is they try really hard to make homes airtight so you don’t necessarily get moisture in, but then if there is any moisture, the walls don’t breathe that well.
Bridgit: Yeah. That’s a great point. Opening windows and doors is a super easy thing to do to let moisture out and let clean air in. Even probably in LA, indoor air quality is worse than outdoor air quality now because of everything like off-gassing in our home. So, yeah, I’m a big fan of just opening up the home.
Dr. Weitz: Right. So, what other health conditions do you find most frequently mold is an underlying cause of or a factor in?
Bridgit: Definitely like I mentioned, digestive issues like chronic digestive issues. I think you should look for mold if you just can’t seem to be getting over things and your practitioner is like, “You’ve got parasites, you’ve got candida, all this stuff. Lyme disease is really closely associated with mold. Hashimoto’s, there’s often a connection there. Let me think. What else? And then, just a lot of symptomatic stuff. Well, I’ll speak to hormones because I think we never think about hormones being caused by mold. You think, “Oh, it’s stress or my diet,” or what have you, but they can lodge in your hypothalamus, pituitary access and inflame it. So, you’re getting like top-down dysregulation of your hormones, plus your liver is burdened, your gut’s probably off. So, yeah, if you’re having chronic symptoms of low libido, weepiness, gaining weight, irregular periods, any of that, it’s totally possible that mold’s involved.
Dr. Weitz: So, what about testing the person for mold?
Bridgit: Yeah. Luckily, there’s a pretty easy at-home urine tests. There’s a few good companies who do that.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. I know you mentioned Great Plains and Vibrant.
Bridgit: Yeah. I think those are the two top ones. I think both of those, you need to go through a practitioner, but I think that’s best anyhow, because just like with… I mentioned the ERMI. It’s hard to read. You’re going to get your own mold results and you’re not going to know like is this really bad? Is this not bad? What do I do about it? You’re going to have a million questions.
Dr. Weitz: Now, I noticed in your book, you were explaining how each one of those tests test a certain number of mycotoxins related to a certain number of species of mold. But of course, there’s so many different species of mold and so many different forms of mycotoxins that I guess either of those tests could miss some of the mycotoxins that might be there.
Bridgit: So, yeah, I think the few different tests all have a bit of their strengths and weaknesses and different strains they test. I think there’s one company that will catch like Stachybotrys better than another. Some practitioners will have you run a few different tests for that reason. But there’s actually only a dozen or so categories of mycotoxin so there’s many, many types. But there’s actually only about 12 toxic molds and about 12-ish mycotoxin groups. So, I think that’s how they’re able to not test as many.
Dr. Weitz: Right. And I noticed you said you like to do provocation.
Bridgit: Yeah. I’ve gotten a little trouble for some of that. So, now we just say use the sauna or fast. We did say use glutathione. We don’t say that anymore.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. Yeah, because I know Great Plain says not to do provocation.
Bridgit: Yeah. So, I would say we do light provocation now, which is just an overnight fast and sauna.
Dr. Weitz: Oh, okay. So, I know other practitioners who recommend glutathione as a provocative agent. I just talked to somebody from Great Plains recently. And they said, “Well, the glutathione can bind to the mycotoxins, and then you might not find them in the urine.”
Bridgit: Yeah. That’s what they told me too. We were recommending it because that’s what I had been taught or heard was best. Of course, we want to find things. We don’t want people to get false negatives, but I have one client who took NAC, so precursor. She was in a moldy home and her first test was negative. Then when she was out, she had a positive test with another company and she wasn’t happy. So, it could have been that, or it could have been just that she wasn’t pushing out mold while she lived in that moldy home. I guess we can’t say for sure, but after that experience, I was like, “Okay, I guess we should just be more cautious and not use,” but yeah.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. I wasn’t sure if I understood because it was not my understanding that glutathione binds to mycotoxins necessarily.
Bridgit: I think it can because besides being an antioxidant, it can bind in the liver as a detoxifier. But I think what they told me on the phone was that they measure… what did they say? Like they measured the mycotoxins by weight. And if there was some binding of glutathione, it could change the weight, and then it wouldn’t be measured. Something like that.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. I’ve always understood that the glutathione helps to stimulate the detoxification process and then it’s the binder that it really attaches to.
Bridgit: Yeah. Yeah. I think potentially, you could do glutathione a few days before. But besides that one person, I never experienced a false negative. We see tons of positives. It’s pretty rare to ever see a negative, which is why I feel like that one case was a little odd.
Dr. Weitz: Right. So, let’s go into your recommendations for treatment of mold illness.
Bridgit: Sure. So, first, do the basics. First, don’t be in a moldy home while you’re trying to detox. It doesn’t work. Be eating a whole food diet, be getting some exercise and sunlight, and making sure you’re sleeping, making sure you’re pooping. So, those are my readiness steps. And if you are doing okay on those, you can start pushing toxins a little more. I really love detox techniques like sauna and coffee enemas and dry brushing. For me when I was really sick, doing those movement techniques helped me a lot. So, I’m a big advocate for getting those in, castor oil packs, Epsom salt baths. There’s some more options.
Dr. Weitz: Oh, where do you place the castor oil packs?
Bridgit: I just do abdomen.
Dr. Weitz: Okay.
Bridgit: Yeah. It’s a glutathione recycler and also helps digestion. And then, I usually do some essential oils with it when I do it at home.
Dr. Weitz: Right. I know you’ve talked about a MATH diet.
Bridgit: Yeah. That’s an acronym I made up at one point because people were always asking what to eat. So, it’s microbiome-friendly, anti-inflammatory, time-restricted, and hydrating. So, it’s just a good base diet to be thinking about.
Dr. Weitz: Right. And you mentioned some essential supplementation you like everybody to be on before you go into the specific mold protocols.
Bridgit: Yeah. Thank you for asking about that. I think we get excited about sexy supplements we’ve heard of like some new binder and all that, but really the liver needs nutrients. The brain needs certain nutrients to just work, and it is burdened. So, getting B vitamins, getting magnesium, getting fish oil. I find sometimes people are skipping some of those basic nutrients. So, I really recommend everybody be on those really for life, our soil quality, our diet, our stressors, just we have more demand for those things and ever.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. I would pretty much consider those things, baseline nutrition for pretty much everybody as well.
Bridgit: Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Weitz: So, let’s go into some of the specific detox treatment protocols. How do we get rid of the mycotoxins?
Bridgit: Sure. This was a little tough to organize because everybody’s obviously a little different on how they’re going to react. So, I just picked my top favorite detox supplements. Those are binders, electrolytes, CoQ10, broccoli seed and sprout. And I’m missing one.
Dr. Weitz: Glutathione.
Bridgit: Glutathione. Thank you.
Dr. Weitz: And you also mentioned CoQ10.
Bridgit: Yeah. I like CoQ10 a lot. A lot of times, your mitochondria are really affected by the toxicity. And so, your cells are tired, you’re tired. So, I based it on things that I really observed helped me quite a bit.
Dr. Weitz: Let’s go into some of the rationale. So, you like CoQ10 for mitochondrial support.
Bridgit: Yes. And it’s a general good antioxidant. It has a lot of different functions. So, I think we think about detox just like the liver, but it’s also creating a lot of oxidative stress. So, I’m a big fan of antioxidants.
Dr. Weitz: And then, why electrolytes?
Bridgit: So, electrolytes came up because one thing that happens often when you have mold is you make less of a hormone called antidiuretic hormone. So, you’re peeing more often potentially and losing minerals that way. Also, we hope you’re using your sauna. So, just staying hydrated. So, our particular electrolyte, we just add some extra B vitamins antioxidants because you can take a very basic electrolyte and that’s fine, but I figured if we’re formulating one for people going through this, we give it a little extra boost.
Dr. Weitz: Do you particularly like infrared sauna?
Bridgit: I do like infrared sauna, but I also advocate for just getting in any sauna.
Dr. Weitz: Just sweating.
Bridgit: Yeah. When I was first sick, I didn’t have my own sauna. I was using saunas at a gym. This was before COVID and they were old-fashioned and they would make me feel amazing. So, I think infrared is great. Far infrared is the best wavelength for detox, but there’s a lot of sauna options out there now, which is great. And we have to be realistic about everybody’s budget. Not everyone can afford a super high-end sauna.
Dr. Weitz: And then, what’s the rationale for glutathione and broccoli seed extract?
Bridgit: So, glutathione, the most prevalent antioxidant in the body. It is leading the charge on oxidative stress and some detoxification in the liver like we talked about. So, if everything’s working normally, it recycles itself and everything’s in balance, but if you’ve been in chronic mold, it’s going to probably be depleted. It’s needing to be restored. So, that’s there just to restore that. Some people may react differently to glutathione. Some people, it’s too much for them, what have you, but it’s always been pretty neutral for me.
Dr. Weitz: What’s your favorite glutathione supplement?
Bridgit: Well, we make one, so I guess I’ll do a little myth-busting then. I think there’s a lot of talk like it has to be liposomal or IV is best. It just has to be absorbed. So, I think there’s more and more ways to [inaudible 00:32:27].
Dr. Weitz: Right. Because a long time ago, we were told glutathione does not get absorbed through the gut. And so, therefore, any oral glutathione’s not going to work. And so, then we thought you could only use IV, and then at some point, we realized, “Well, that’s not really accurate.”
Bridgit: Exactly. Yeah. We hear something from somebody. And so, our glutathione is called S-acetyl glutathione. So, they just attach a group to the glutathione so that it stays on the glutathione in the gut into the bloodstream and then breaks off in the bloodstream so it can go in the cell. So, yeah, basically, any way you’re making… I think if you just ingest straight glutathione, it will be broken up in the stomach, but yeah, any way that they’re making it more absorbable is what’s important.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. And then, broccoli seed extract.
Bridgit: Yeah. This one’s super interesting. So, we were already using this.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. Not everybody includes that in their mold detox.
Bridgit: It’s a little, yeah, it’s unusual. I first learned about it from just, it detoxes a lot of chemicals like gasoline additives and stuff. Then I learned about it during COVID. It’s actually quite good for your liver health where some of your immune cells mature. And then, later, I found out it’s good for supporting the glucuronidation pathway where some mycotoxins are broken down. So, I was like, “This is amazing because I already loved broccoli seed and sprout.” They’re very well tolerated. And we want to decrease our overall toxic burden, which it does and it helps the liver work more efficiently. It actually helps direct the liver to make more… or direct your genes to make more antioxidants. So, it’s just one of those things where you read the data on it and it’s pretty incredible.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. What about binders? What binders should we use? Are there certain binders work better for certain types of mycotoxins?
Bridgit: Yeah. So, there’s been more reporting I’ll say around which binders work for which mycotoxins. Most of that research was done in terms of animal feed. In animal industry, there’s been a lot of issues with mycotoxins and animal health. So, a lot of that research wasn’t done for humans. It was done for farming, but now, I would say modern functional practitioners are mining that data and saying, “Well, this is good for this. So, this is good.” I think that’s really interesting. And when we made our binder, we just used some of that information to make sure we hit all categories of mycotoxins. But I think it’s also a little dangerous. So, let’s say you get a urine test and it shows one or two types of mold. We don’t know that that’s the only thing you’ve been exposed to. It’s just a snapshot. So, you can play around with matching your type with the binder that goes with it. Especially if you’re sensitive like if you want to just use a single ingredient binder, you may want to play around with matching it or you can rotate. You can take charcoal and then pectin and then humic acid. You may not like all of them. Your body may not like all of them. So, we can play around.
Dr. Weitz: Which are some of your favorite binders?
Bridgit: Well, I like charcoal. It’s affordable and it gets the job done and also helps for like stomach upset and little stomach bugs. It can be a little constipating for people. It’s never been for me, but binders in general can be a little constipating for people.
Dr. Weitz: And then, zeolite, is that a good one?
Bridgit: Yeah. Zeolite is good. It’s like a porous rock if I remember correctly. Most of them are porous in some way or have a charge to pull toxins to them. So, the binder we formulated, we just have a bit of a grab bag of just different types of binders so we can catch different things.
Dr. Weitz: I’d like to interrupt this fascinating discussion we’re having for another few minutes to tell you about another really exciting product that has changed my life and the life of my family, especially as it pertains to getting good quality sleep. It’s something called the chiliPAD, C-H-I-L-I-P-A-D. It can be found at the website chilisleep.com, which is C-H-I-L-I-S-L-E-E-P dot com.
So, this product involves a water-cooled mattress pad that goes underneath your sheets and helps you maintain a constant temperature at night. If you’ve ever gotten woken up because temperature has changed, typically gets warmer, this product will maintain your body at a very even temperature, and it tends to promote uninterrupted quality deep and REM sleep, which is super important for healing and for overall health.
If you go to chilisleep.com and you use the affiliate code, Weitz20, that’s my last name, W-E-I-T-Z, 20. You’ll get 20% off a chiliPAD. So, check it out and let’s get back to this discussion.
Dr. Weitz: Do you often or sometimes use antifungal, natural antifungal agents while treating the mycotoxins?
Bridgit: Yeah, usually I would do it as a later step in a gut protocol. Once the body’s cleared some things, is improving, the immune system is getting stronger. I think doing it too soon isn’t going to stick usually. And there’s a lot of die-off can be happening.
Dr. Weitz: Right. So, what do you do if there’s die-off?
Bridgit: You cut back on whenever you’re taking, for sure. You could do an Epsom salt bath. In the moment, you can do a binder, you can have an Advil if you need to, but generally, you want to back off and manage it differently. If you’re having die-off, your body… If you’re having die-off symptoms, I’ll say, like you’re getting headaches, you don’t feel well from your detox. It’s too much. Your body’s not keeping up. So, it’s a detriment to you to get in that state for too long.
Dr. Weitz: Do you incorporate supplements to try to stimulate bile flow since a lot of times, these toxins end up in the bile as part of how they get into the digestive tract?
Bridgit: Yeah. I think those are good. We have artichoke and our binder for that. Coffee enemas will help facilitate that, bitters help facilitate that. A lot of people have motility issues with mold, and I think there’s some brain inflammation like vagal nerve issues. So, yeah, I think stimulating everything to move is often needed for these folks.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. I noticed you also mention in your book, Epsom salt bath, dry brushing, and mouth taping.
Bridgit: Yeah. Yeah. Mouth taping probably sounds like the weirdest one, but it was really helpful for me. I didn’t know it, but I was like a mouth breather when I slept and now my immune system was depleted. So, I wake up with sore throats all the time and it would take me hours to feel better again. And so, then, I saw a video about mouth taping and I was like, “Oh, sounds like something.” Basically just putting a little bandage over your mouth at night so you breathe through your nose.
Bridgit: It’s so simple that it makes more nitric oxide. It helps you sleep better. It’s good for your oral hygiene, your immune system. So, again, because it really did make a difference for me, I put it in my top five.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. And then, you have a section where you talk about diet for patients with mold illness. And you mentioned your microbiome-friendly MATH diet, but in there, you also mentioned a low mold diet, a low FODMAP diet, and even a low histamine diet. And I think it’s pretty common to typically recommend a low mold diet, which means foods that are actually fungi like mushrooms or food that may contain mold should be avoided.
Bridgit: Yeah. Usually, there’s some crossover that some of these foods that tend to be moldy like alcohol and cheese and like conventional meats, grains. They’re all so often histamine-related foods. Or they’re just inflammatory foods. So, mostly, in our modern society, you’re not going to get a huge amount of mold from food, but when you’re already dealing with it from your home when you’re trying to recover, you don’t want foods that are going to stimulate a reaction or more inflammation or a histamine release. Excuse me. So, it’s not forever, but yeah, there’s generally going to be… you know what I mean? You have to be on good behavior for a while.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. And then, why do you sometimes use a low FODMAP diet?
Bridgit: Yeah, that one I learned about from Susanne Bennett, who’s in LA too.
Dr. Weitz: Who’s a good friend of mine. Yes.
Bridgit: Oh, nice. Yeah. She was one of my practitioners when I was sick and she wrote a mitochondria book and she had the little FODMAP diet in there because she said the gases that are produced from digesting these foods are like a strain on your system. So, I thought I might as well try it. So, I did it for a month and then I started reintroducing foods. And I thought it was a really interesting experience. There’s some foods I kept out of my diet. So, I think for certain people who are experiencing a lot of poor motility, SIBO bloating, it could be a good temporary diet for people.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. I use it quite frequently for patients with SIBO IBS. Yeah.
Bridgit: Yeah. Yeah. It doesn’t have to be forever and it may not be every food on the list.
Dr. Weitz: No, you don’t want to do it forever. Because you’re excluding a lot of super healthy foods like broccoli.
Bridgit: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And for me, I just found a couple of foods were my biggest trigger. Actually, grapes were one of them. And I just bought some this week and I did fine with them all week. But there was some years where every time I had grapes or apples, I would feel really bloated.
Dr. Weitz: Interesting. Why do you think that was?
Bridgit: Well, they’re FODMAPs and those particular ones for some reason, maybe because I don’t eat them as much. Like garlic and onion were not a problem for me at all, but maybe I eat those all the time so my body was more used to them.
Dr. Weitz: I know apples can, especially apple juices, can often be a source of mold. Right?
Bridgit: For sure.
Dr. Weitz: Right.
Bridgit: Yeah. When they say from concentrate, that’s like it’s bad. It’s very processed. And it’s not like they’re picking the apple off the tree. It’s like just dumping them in a barrel and smashing them up and making them into powder then adding water.
Dr. Weitz: Right. I remember seeing somebody cut open some of this apple sauce that comes in these squeezy containers and stuff. And it was just horrible. You couldn’t believe the amount of mold in any of these squeezy foods, apple sauce or yogurt, or any of these things. It’s really bad.
Bridgit: Oh, wow. I didn’t know about that. Yeah. Fruit juices can be one. Just a side note, as we feed our toddlers, a lot of times, we’re giving them these low-quality process things that crackers and juice boxes and stuff and, yeah. They’re not clean foods.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. And speaking of kids, I remember the same presentation, she showed some of these bath toys, like the little rubber ducky and you cut it open and inside, it just really, you know.
Bridgit: Oh, yeah. I’ve had that experience. Like you squeeze out the ducky and there’s mold coming out and you’re like, “Oh, my gosh.”
Dr. Weitz: All right. Great. So, anything else that we haven’t covered that you’d like to talk about?
Bridgit: I think we covered a lot of things. I think mostly, if people just are curious and they want to get started, you’re mostly curious about your home and that’s often a great starting point. Right? Because it is your environment that affects your health. So, even though I’m not as much of a home expert, if you suspect it because you’ve been chronically ill. Or like you said, you might not even really suspect your home, but if you’ve been chronically ill, you’re just going to doctor after doctor, you’re not getting better. We have some free eBooks on the website and blogs like just start informing yourself like could this be mold because if it is, you want to know about it because you’re not going to get better without doing something about it.
Dr. Weitz: Good. And so, for resources for practitioners, your book is an excellent resource.
Bridgit: Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. I definitely think it’s detailed enough that a lot of practitioners are going to get at. Because as a practitioner, I’m sure this happens for you. People are like, “Well, which stuff can I keep? And how do I can find a good inspector,” and all these questions and yeah. And you want to try to have answers. So, there’s just so many questions. So, I think it’s a great book for, you’re already out of the home and you’re still healing or you’re in the beginning. It’s just the whole process.
Dr. Weitz: Yeah. Speaking of that, I’m glad we talked about the ERMI test because I often recommend that. But every time I get to report back, it’s like, “Well, it shows you have some mold.”
Bridgit: Yeah. It’s so hard to read. You’ll have to look at that ERMI Code. I think it’s only $37 for people to enter their ERMI in there. So, I think that’s a great innovation. Yeah. It’s tough. Those first questions about the home are… it’s like a puzzle.
Dr. Weitz: And then, you got all the types of mold and then you got the types of mycotoxins, and then putting it all together is a bit tricky.
Bridgit: Yes. It’s very confusing.
Dr. Weitz: Okay. So, any final thoughts?
Bridgit: No, I really appreciate you actually reading the book. It warms my heart. So, thank you so much. I worked very hard on that. I can really tell-
Dr. Weitz: That’s really a labor of love, right?
Bridgit: Yeah. I can really tell you’re just learning and I really just appreciate you doing that and sharing it with your audience.
Dr. Weitz: Thank you for making it all the way through this episode of the Rational Wellness Podcast. And if you enjoyed this podcast, please go to Apple podcast and give us a five-star ratings and review. That way, more people will be able to find this Rational Wellness Podcast when they’re searching for health podcasts. And I wanted to let everybody know that I do now have a few openings for new nutritional consultations for patients at my Santa Monica Weitz Sports Chiropractic and Nutrition clinic. So, if you’re interested, please call my office, 310-395-3111, and sign up for one of the few remaining slots for a comprehensive nutritional consultation with Dr. Ben Weitz. Thank you, and see you next week.
